excoriator
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Post by excoriator on Sept 14, 2017 12:19:07 GMT
I don't have a Bitcoin account, but increasingly think perhaps I should do. Given a choice of putting my trust in a bank, a government, or what appears to be sound mathematics I feel I should choose the third. The fact that it is now beginning to come under attack from the banks who deal in conventional currencies means that it is looking as if it will soon become mainstream. The fact that the money they create and deal in has few of the advantages of the block-chain based currency is a clear threat to them. Governments will not like it either. Controlling the money supply is their main method of controlling the economy.
Anyone here with any experience of it?
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jonjel
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Post by jonjel on Sept 14, 2017 13:31:12 GMT
I don't have a Bitcoin account, but increasingly think perhaps I should do. Given a choice of putting my trust in a bank, a government, or what appears to be sound mathematics I feel I should choose the third. The fact that it is now beginning to come under attack from the banks who deal in conventional currencies means that it is looking as if it will soon become mainstream. The fact that the money they create and deal in has few of the advantages of the block-chain based currency is a clear threat to them. Governments will not like it either. Controlling the money supply is their main method of controlling the economy. Anyone here with any experience of it? I have no experience of it Exco and don't think I want to know. Now this is a genuine question. Explain to me in simple language how it works, who is underpinning it and so on. Our government effectively underpin our currency. As far as I know you can't just go to the pub and buy a pint with one in your pocket. How is the value set? It seems to make absolutely no sense to me. We have the 'Bristol Pound' around here, and I avoid it. I see no point other than persuading people to shop locally, ad I think there are better ways of doing that than creating a barter exchange voucher system.
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excoriator
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Post by excoriator on Sept 14, 2017 14:36:22 GMT
In the simplest possible terms it is underpinned by a mathematically guaranteed 'accounting trail' - an unforgeable record of the transactions that money has been through. The computing is distributed across many sites, and as long as their computing power exceeds that of any attacking group it is secure. These computing outfits are rewarded by finding new bitcoins as part of their computing efforts and the fact that they can make more money by playing by the rules than by breaking them. There are thousands and thousands of these sites. It has the advantage that there is no 'third party' that needs to be trusted, and just like 'real' money, there is no readable record of transactions that can be traced. The accounting trail, though it guarantees that the money is real and has not been spent twice cannot be used to trace individual transactions. Being outside government control, it cannot be 'devalued' without warning or otherwise reduced in value like our pounds were after the brexit vote, and probably will be again. It is worth reading the original paper defining the idea. It is largely diagrammatic and non-mathematical. (https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf) You may also like to look at steemit.com/bitcoin/@dr-physics/bitcoin-white-paper-explained-bitcoin-made-easy which explains it. I feel it is very likely that the pound will crash horrifically on a hard brexit, and perhaps Bitcoins might be a good way of preserving their value. Also, despite sometimes quite dramatic reverses its value is rising exponentially as more and more people start using it. Here's a bit more about it and the claim that it is a bubble: www.marketwatch.com/story/bitcoin-at-crossroads-after-shedding-nearly-20-billion-in-value-2017-09-13 If it's a fraud, I can't see who the fraudsters are. I can't see who is going to gain from it. Neither, apparently, can its banking critics as they have not explained possible frauds. In conclusion it may be worth a punt. If it continues to grow as it has, then even a tenner could make you very rich indeed in decade or two, not that I am advising anyone to follow my advice.
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jean
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Post by jean on Sept 14, 2017 14:41:15 GMT
Also like 'real' money, it can be stolen, can't it? Possibly even more easily...
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excoriator
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Post by excoriator on Sept 14, 2017 14:54:33 GMT
Well, no. Not really. Read up on the papers I quoted. It is more secure than hiding it under your mattress.
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jonjel
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Post by jonjel on Sept 14, 2017 15:10:14 GMT
Well, no. Not really. Read up on the papers I quoted. It is more secure than hiding it under your mattress. Bad thoughts again. If I wanted to hide money I think I might chose Dianne Abbots mattress. Very difficult to access and no one really wants to go there! Sorry, could not resist that. Now back to bitcoins. It sounds good but I am still not convinced. I am wondering how I would quote one of my customers for a job worth say 20 grand in bitcins.
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Post by aubrey on Sept 14, 2017 15:41:22 GMT
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jonjel
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Post by jonjel on Sept 14, 2017 15:48:00 GMT
My flippant comment was hardy out of the same box as that Aubs. And you know me pretty well. Do you really think I would insult anyone over their race colour or ethnicity? I would criticise her for being a hypocrite in sending her child to a private school when her local schools have excellent ofsted reports, but I really want to get back to bitcoins.
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Post by aubrey on Sept 14, 2017 15:53:16 GMT
I know. But she gets a hell of a lot of stick, very little of it warranted.
I know nothing about bitcoins, sadly.
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excoriator
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Post by excoriator on Sept 14, 2017 16:07:31 GMT
Abusing an individual or an underprivileged group is part and parcel of what passes for humour in bluarse meetings. They get quite testy about it when it is pointed out too. "Political correctness gone mad" is their frequent whine when those that suffer it complain about their nasty remarks.
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excoriator
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Post by excoriator on Sept 14, 2017 17:17:45 GMT
I think the point is that 'trusted third parties' have been inevitably involved if you want to secure a transaction. Sadly, these all too frequently turn out not to very trustworthy at all.
Bitcoin is a way of securing electronic financial transactions which is secure but doesn't need a 'trusted' third party. Only the payer and the payee are involved; the third party being replaced by a community of computers.
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jean
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Post by jean on Sept 14, 2017 17:20:34 GMT
Abusing an individual or an underprivileged group is part and parcel of what passes for humour in bluarse meetings. Labour are quite good at it, too.
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jonjel
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Post by jonjel on Sept 14, 2017 17:26:22 GMT
Abusing an individual or an underprivileged group is part and parcel of what passes for humour in bluarse meetings. Labour are quite good at it, too. Lighten up a bit Exco otherwise I will crowbar climate change in here!
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excoriator
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Post by excoriator on Sept 14, 2017 19:30:48 GMT
Come on Jonjel. This is not the first time you have tried tory humour here and found it not well received. Your misjudgement, not mine.
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